Why the Us-Versus-Them Mentality Is the Fastest Path to Team Self-Destruction | Lai-Ling Su

Why the Us-Versus-Them Mentality Is the Fastest Path to Team Self-Destruction | Lai-Ling Su

16:54 Feb 24, 2026
About this episode
Lai-Ling Su: Why the Us-Versus-Them Mentality Is the Fastest Path to Team Self-Destruction Read the full Show Notes and search through the world's largest audio library on Agile and Scrum directly on the Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast website: http://bit.ly/SMTP_ShowNotes. "The quickest way to self-destruction is to have an us-versus-them mentality. Because it permeates into every behavior, every action or inaction, and it impacts every single outcome as a result of it." - Lai-Ling Su Lai-Ling shares a compelling story about a leadership team in healthcare technology that was self-sabotaging their way into non-delivery—so much so that critical commercial outcomes were at serious risk. Yet the team themselves couldn't see it; it was invisible to them. She identifies three layers of the us-versus-them dynamic that needed unpicking. First, recent M&A activity had merged a larger corporate entity with a smaller, more nimble one, and people remained ferociously loyal to leaders from their old organizations. Second, business goals were separate from technology goals, causing people to fall back to people-pleasing within their direct reporting lines rather than collaborating on shared purpose. Third, the tension between growth ambitions and addressing legacy activities created another divide. What struck Lai-Ling most was how these "classic" patterns were invisible to those experiencing them—they just accepted it as part of doing business. The destruction wasn't always stormy and visible; sometimes it was silent, with work piling up, nothing getting done, yet no one overtly upset. In this segment, we talk about the importance of creating awareness and how Scrum Masters must be willing to point out these patterns, even at the risk of being seen as the odd ones out. Self-reflection Question: What "classic" anti-patterns might be invisible in your organization right now because everyone has accepted them as just part of doing business? Featured Book of the Week: The Checklist Manifesto by Atul Gawande Lai-Ling approaches the book recommendation differently—she believes no single book has fundamentally influenced her,
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